ARENA water instinct

IN THE ARENA

David Davies (GBR) Vs Thomas Lurz (GER)

Make Way For The Mighty Marathon Men

If anyone were to compile a list of the toughest men from the world of swimming, then the latest protagonists in our How Rivals Square Up feature would surely stand tall a stroke or several beyond the pack.

In the red corner from Wales, David Davies, an Olympic 1,500m bronze medallist who stepped up in volume for the inaugural Olympic marathon in Beijing and did himself and Britain proud with a silver medal in what was only the third 10km race of his life in his first season of racing the distance.

In the blue corner, Thomas Lurz, a German world multiple champion and Olympic bronze medallist behind Davies who the Welshman describes as being "as hard as nails".

The answers given by these two exceptional, and exceptionally hard-working, athletes provide us with a glimpse of the extraordinary nature of the swimmers and the sport in which they excel. Take a look at the examples they give as the hardest sets they have endured - but make sure you're sitting down when you do. Just contemplating those sets would leave most of us, swimmers of the mortal kind and non-swimmers alike a touch short of breath.

The dedication of the two men is matched by exemplary levels of discipline and professionalism. Within 48 hours of our engagement with the mighty marathon men for this exercise, the answers were in, the job done, the next set of 20x200s or 5x1,500m already under way.


1. Describe what it felt like to line up for the first, historic, Olympic 10km marathon race - what emotions, what thoughts were racing - and then tell us what you felt like, physically and mentally, in the closing 200m or so of the race?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

Going into it I was kind of naive. I hadn't really taken on board how historic and special it was. I was new to it and the marathon was a bonus event for me at the time, with 1,500 the thing for me. The 10km was just another chanced. I was pretty nervous and excited at the time because of the swim I'd had in Seville (Olympic qualifier) but then when we'd all settled in and the race took shape It was a serious race like any other, even though the occasion had something very special about it special. To get a medal in the first Olympic marathon was special as well. The thing I was proudest of was to get back-to-back Olympic medals [after bronze in the 1,500m in Athens, 2004]. The last bit of the race is still hazy for me. I remember kicking off the last buoy and putting my foot on the gas. There were just three of left not long after and I was weaving all over the place. I got my second wind but then got my line wrong towards the finish. I managed to get past Thomas but the Dutch guy [Maarten van der Weijden] had found the perfect line and I couldn't get to him. I just remember thinking 'Oh, my God - thank God its over!'.

It felt great. Open water earned a place in the Olympic programme because its so hard and such a tough sport.I felt pretty good throughout the whole race and I was swimming a little bit wrong [lost my way] at the finish, but I was satisfied with the bronze medal. The conditions in Beijing weren't really open water like it is in the sea, with waves. It was more like in the pool without turns but all the same it was very nice and many are looking forward to London 2012.



2. The pool work you do for a 1500m, say, is high metreage/volume stuff. But are there specific things that you do purely with a view to improving your marathon performance that you would not do if you stuck only to pool racing - and if so, what are they?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"There's no such thing as a pure pool swimmer or a pure open water swimmer [within the marathon set]. If you're a good enough distance swimmer you can do both. Some like one better than the other. Some of the work I do includes specific sets that are aimed just at the 1,500m, like sets of 100m on a specific pace. And if I do a big endurance set of 5 or 6km at a pace I can hold in open water, that's also good for my 1,500m. If I went full time open water - and I don't want to do - I would change things very slightly. I'd probably up the distance a bit and do one more endurance set. But it is pretty much like for like."

"I do almost all my training sessions in the pool. I do just some extra ergometer training on a bike on dryland. My preparation is nearly the same as what I did in the past when I swum the 1500m freestyle. I do a little bit more volume and longer sets today. The big difference is there are no turns, and the big thing is experience in the race and getting the feeling for the 10km."



3. How often do you think of the rivals in your event - or is it a question of only focusing on yourself?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"I do think about rivals in training at certain times. When times are tough and I'm not at my best and I need to slog it out, if I'm on my own ploughing up and down, I find it useful to visualise racing somhow. It sounds a bit sad but I do visualise races when I need extra incentive in training. I've just done more than 200km in the past two weeks. The finishing set at the end of it all was a set of 100s and Kevin [Renshaw, coach] said to me 'right, you're up against Thomas now, and make sure you beat him - make it your best.' If I'm feeling tired, then thinking about things like that can really help. It's important to think about rivals because you have to rememver why you're doing it all and why you're getting up at that time in morning and putting yourself through it every day. It's not good to get obsessed about it but you have to challenge yourself to be better than them all the time."

I very often think of and look at my rivals. I watch their stroke frequency and find out where the big favourites are swimming. Mostly I can see every good swimmer in the race. I have my eyes on them but I also concentrate on my stroke and on the course and my tactics.



4. Who are three of your biggest opponents and why do they stand out?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

Yuri Prilukov: I raced him from a really young age and at European Junior championships. The first time I thought 'my God, he's a hard Russian ma' - he has that look about him and we had some really hard races. He's a really, really tough guy ... he has a 'Rocky IV' Russian guy look about him, a tough man to be in the call room with. I couldn't speak Russian and I thought he couldn't speak English so for five years we just smiled and shook hands, then I heard him speaking English to Mateusz Sawrymowicz (POL) and said 'oh, right you can speak English, and we got to know each other a little better after that."; Grant Hackett: he was my idol when I was younger and he was amazing. i beat him once, when he was out of shape in melbourne 2007. His record was unbelievable. He was a hard, hard man who wanted it so much, he had all the right attitudes and approaches. And Thomas, because he's as hard as nails. I'll give you an example: we were swimming in New York [Hudson River] and in the choppiest water I've ever been in; there were bare rocks and like me, Thomas tends to drift, so when I saw him on the rocks I thouhgt 'that's him gone', I thought he'd had it but he came back and won the race."

Vladimir Dyatchin - he's got very good experience and has been very sucessful in the last years; Spiridon Gyiannotis - he's very light and can swim very many kilometers at good speed; David Davies, because he has fast speed during the whole race.



5. At this stage in your career and given what you have already achieved, what motivates you - and are there specific ways in which you find motivation each and every day, through thick and thin?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"The single reason why I'm still in the sport - and after I achieved far more as a youngster than I thought I ever would - is that I got bronze (Athens 2004), then silver (Beijing 2008) and now I want to win the gold. It's not an obsession but I want to try to do it. I think I have a bit to prove yet on 1,500m and in open water too after what happened in Beijing (disorientation in the closing 300m or so lost him the lead and race). I started afresh after Beijing and started with a whole new philosophy on competing and training and changed a lot through the help I got from Kevin at Loughborough. It's a home Olympics, an historic Olympics. I just have to be there and I have to be a part of it. I train with an amazing group of swimmers - both Kev's group and [coach] Ben Titley's group, a pool full of talent and full of personalities, and its very enjoyable to be a part of it. "

My biggest motivation is the Olympic Games in London 2012. I have won in my sport everything - only the Olympic gold is missing, and I can the chance once more to win this in London. I like to race in open water: it's fun because there are more tactics than in the pool and every race is different. This makes it exciting. Those are the things that motivate me and get me to and through the hard training every day."



6. What is the toughest training set you have ever done, why does it stand out (physically/mentally or both), and what mechanisms did you/do you employ to help you to endure?"

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"The toughest, the one that stands out, is one I did recently. Just the look of it was horrible. It was split over two sessions: 5x1,500m ... then 5x1500m again. The aim was to start out on 10km tempo of about 63sec [short-course] and getting faster. It was during Kev's hell weeks of 200km and more. I started off feeling good on the first one but went 10sec faster than I should have gone, but Kev said 'that's your own fault, you can't go slower now. At some stage you just hit the wall and start feeling very sick. No 5 was a real grind, the worst thing I've done. Before the last one [No 10], Kev said 'I want the last 400m under 4mins, and the last 100 under 55sec. I did it and was really happy I'd done it. The other hard one at the other end [of the spectrum] is 800m doing 8x100m ... hitting 55 and 54 long-course. You just keep going 'til your lactate blows you out. They say distance swimmers don't build lactate. I was shaking from lactate. It went higher than Caitlin (McClatchey), then Jo [Jackson]. I was still going strong when they'd all fallen out."

40x200m free on 2:30,  averaging 2:06,  or 12km freestyle [straight] - but the toughest thing is not just that you have only one set to do: you've done one and the next is coming up very soon. So the hard and constant work is the hard thing. To swim one set is hard but to do this many years its much harder. I have a good training partner in Jan Wolfgarten and a very good coach, my brother Stefan. We help each other very much.



7. The marathon is known for being physical in the boxing sense of the word, as opposed to the self-inflicted kind of physical? Can you prepare yourself for that, and if so, how do you do so, and have your strategies been successful?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

In Beijing I adopted a strategy of staying out of trouble and swimming in as much clear water as I could. I had no experience of swimming in the pack. I think that's still the best way for me to go but you can't always make that happen. You have to think on your feet, know when to move out of pack, when to make a break or even when to drop back. The physical side is tough. You go from a nice lane in a pool to a pack of hungry people wanting to do well. And you better have quick reactions.

I try to get away from the boxing because it drains a lot of power, the energy I surely need in the finishing part of the race. I try to swim at the side of the pack but when it [physical clashes] happens, it happens ... then you need to fight and try to be faster or try to swim out to the side again.



8. What are you looking forward to as far as training during the coming season is concerned - and what, if anything, are you dreading?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

I've probably done the hardest bit in some ways. From November until now was all about 20x400m, 10x1500 in a day, running, getting lean and fit again and getting back in and through all of that after a break was the hardest bit. I'm just starting to pick up pace and do some speed stuff. You don't dread hard training. I chose Kev's squad because it is one of the hardest squads in Britain. The sets will make you feel sick so you don't look forward to them. In October, the 1,500m [at Commonwealth Games] marks the moment I decide whether I will go ahead with it for London 2012 or just put all my eggs in one basket and focus on the marathon.

I am looking to get through the season without illness and injuries, while maintaining solid volume and good quality. My main events are the European Championships in Hungary and the Open Water World Championships in Roberval in Canada.



9. How much non-water training do you do and what form does it take (other sports, gym etc)?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"In early season I do a lot of running (good to get the weight off and put some strength in the legs); we do a lot of circuit stuff and half an hour every morning of core stability exercises, plus two land conditioning sets a week, of 45 minutes or so. I do one session a week of strength work in the gym. That's a lot more than I ever used to do. I never thought it was relevant but in Beijing it cost me, against the Mellouli's and others who were stronger than me. It's not just about fit and fast - you have to be all an round swimmer as well."

I do some other land-based things like ergometer training on the bike and I am doing gym as well. I do weights twice a week for sure and sometimes go three times.



10. Describe your relationship with your coach(es) and its importance to preparing you as an athlete - and tell us what your coach means to you (what role does he play) on race day?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

On race day I don;t really need much from Kev. I normally do things on my own. I like him to be there for a coffee and the company. I don't really need him to be motivational and pick me up, I know what I need to be and do. It's business - and Kev knows that. We are very, very close. We do speak a lot and he has helped me in my life outside swimming. I'm close to his wife and me and my girlfriend go out to dinner with Kev and his wife. He's a friend too, not just a coach. He's an emotional coach, he gets into us as humans, he's passionate about it all. He likes having team chats and getting us together. He knows how to get the best out of me. If he sees me head down, quiet and not speaking as much as usual, he knows I'm tired and he'll give me a kick up the backside if he thinks that's what I need. And when we're going good, he's really up. He lives every single moment with us.

My coach is my brother, Stefan, and he also did open water races in the past, European Championships and so on. We understand each other very well and he also helps me during the race and gives me the drinks and tell me who is first or leading the field and so on. He has good experience in the sport.



11. How important are parents, family and friends when it comes to you being the athlete that you are?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"My friends and the people train with are the people that I'm most influenced by. We're a small group and we rebound off each other. It's very positive. If Jo [Jackson] is swimming the house down, it is easy to respond to that. and the reverse applies. We do support each other and are we're a close knit group. My parents, what can I say: they also produced me, so that's the ultimate contribution to my athletic ability. They support me in whatever I decide to do and have never questioned it. They just support me. They often come up to Loughborough, my mum cleans the house and dad does the garden."

The family is the most important thing. They helped me when I was a kid and they supported me the most. I am very thankful for this. We are a swimming family and I love my swimming club back home in Germany. Its like the Bayern Munich in football. [Answered with beaming smiley]



12. In the pool there is a ready room. It can be intense and tense. How does the assembly point and the line-up differ in open water (or how similar is it)?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

It's really different. For an hour to and hour and a half before, we get numbered up, on hands and shoulders, we all queue up for that so you see each other straight away at the venue. Open water is a lot different. It;s a lot more friendly. A few years ago it was the same people on the circuit week in and week out and they had meals and a few drinks together. I thought I wouldn't fit it. But I know a few more people now and I like it. Anyhow, you get numbered up and then called about 20 to 30 minutes before a race to sit in the tent where the race refereee talks to you and gives instructions and information on the race ... he checks fingernails and so on. We spend alot of time together before the race and then there's 5 minutes or so on the pontoon waiting for the start. In the race pool its 15mins in the room, straight out to the blocks. It can be 2 hours or so in open water but everyone has a lot of respect for one another. In 10km there's no slacking. Everyone is there to do a really hard job.

In open water, the room is much bigger because there are just more swimmers in one race, so the calling room is bigger and every one is trying to do something and preparing for the race, drink or take energy gel. Its different to the pool. You just need to do more than in the pool to prepare for the race but that's obvious because the race is just 2 hours long! [smiley]



13. Is there anything you must do as you approach the start of a race, or on race day, a habit, a ritual that forms part of preparing for performance (if rituals are part of your world)?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

Not something I have to do every time but I like to have a coffee, not for the caffeine, just because I like a nice cup of coffee every day. I like having clean teeth, clean fingernails. I like to feel clean and I splash water on myself to feel fresh. I don't have to do any of that. I have no set routines apart from going into myself a little.

I have many things I like to do. It started with good eating and much drinking, because you should not go in the race without this because otherwise you will die during the race. A warm-up swim and also the concentration at the start to get a good position and not end up in the fighting group during the start where the whole pack is.



14. When did you first become aware of your rival in this exercise and what dimension has that rival brought to your own preparations?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

I first met Thomas on the pool circuit 2005-06. We raced at European short-course champs a couple of times, then I heard he'd gone to open water and was doing really, really well and was one of the top swimmers in that scene. I only really got to know him better after we had to gone head to head. He's one of toughest swimmers. He's getting on a bit now but still going strong. He's like any other rival - it's not easy being at the top of your sport and staying there. You know with Thomas that whether he has a good day or a bad day he's going to be tough.

Nothing. I have my own preparations and habits. I am not looking to others and I will do my own thing. The first time I recall being aware of him as a rival was a long time ago. I knew him from pool races and when I saw his technique and his best times in the 400m to compare with his 1,500m times I knew that he could do a very good 10k swim. Then the only thing is to get experience and to get used to swimming in the sea or lakes.



15. What is your rival's strength - and what is yours?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"His ability to keep going and churning it out no matter how he feels. A couple of times this pat year, a couple of people have been around him at the end but he always won it and had that ability to find that bit extra. As for me, I think I've got a natural ability to keep churning out a good stroke rythym and pace in which I don't use alot of gylyogen energy. I sit quite high in the water, have a high stroke rate and can keep churning it out. My background in the pool has given me speed. As a 3:35 400m swimmer I can kick hard at the end and find finishing speed. Throughout my whole career, I think tenacity has been important. To always pull through. Many distance swimmers would say that was their best attribute."

The strength of all of rivals is that no-one gives up. They fight until the race is over and it doesn't matter how long I am leading the race. Mine is also fighting very well - and give everything I can."



16. Many can understand the thrill of a 100m free, the speed of it, and so forth. Marathons take a little longer. What is it about the marathon that attracts you, where is the thrill, what would you say makes this great sport?"

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

I can underatnd why people might rather watch 100m, 50m or whatever but the biggest reaction I got when the girls [Kerri-Anne Payne and Cassie Patten, Olympic silver and bronze] swam as well as they did was that they couldn't believe that people could swim so fast for so long. It's 2hrs of non-stop high-intense pace and I think that's why it became popular. It's like marathon running, not always the greatest thing to watch but people love it. Marathon chose me rather than me chosing the marathon. I think in London 2012 the event could be an amazing focal point of the whole Games: eight laps of the Serpentine in Hyde Park, where people can stand around the lake, enjoy the park, feel a part of it without paying a lot. If you can drive for two hours to London, watch some Olympic action for 2 hours and then enjoy a day in London ... It'll be fantastic.

"There are many thrills. The conditions in the water, like salt water, waves, jellyfish, sharks. fights in the group to get better positions, when the swimmers go to have a drink and how they fight there to get their drinks; and the finish in the last metres after nearly 2 hours swimming. And sometimes settings: nature or big sights of the city, for example the Statue of Liberty as the backdrop to the New York City world cup."



17. Looking back at your own career so far, are there certain moments that stand out beyond all others - and if so, what are they and why (this can be racing, training, a moment in a relationship, a lesson, and a race result, whatever makes it for you)?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"My first Olympic medal was amazing. Something I knew I could do but to do it was so unbelievable. To be so young and naive and to do it was just amazing. It was the best time in my life, the whole day was amazing. Those who put me in touch and the relationship I had with Bob [Treffene, Australian sports scientists brought to Britain by head coach Bill Sweetenham and a long-term colleague of Davies former coach Dave Haller]. He completely changed me and my life and the way I see my sport. I would never have won that medal in Athnes without him. I took a long break after Beijing and many thought I was finished in the pool so it gave me a lot of pride to do the 3:45 over 400m in Sheffield last year. A few weeks before I'd be holding 56s in 100 sets and Jo [Jackson] 59s. Kevin said that Jo would break the world record in 4 minutes and I'd go 3:46. Ian [Armiger, coach at Loughborough] said he agreed on Jo but thought I couldn't do it. But I did."

There are a few. The silver medal in the 10k race in Melbourne (world championships 2007) with Diyatchin was the best finish: just 0.02 sec separated us. The Olympic moments, and the two golds in one world championship, in 2006 and 2009.



18. Conditions vary in open water - greatly. Can you describe the best and the worst of your experience - and what made them best and worst?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"In February 2008, the best was the first open 10km I ever did: it was in South Africa at a water-ski resort, a reservoir. It was 34 degrees out and 26 degrees in the water, like a pool. The water was so clear you could drink it, and I did. It was millpond conditions. That was the perfect way to start of in the sport. The worst was the world cup this past year in Bulgaria: they'd planned the course out wrong, the buoys were way to wide. They said to us 'do 2 laps instead of 3'. It might have been funny. There were jellyfish and I got stung. No-one knew what was happening. It was terrible. And then in New york, that was really, really rough.. I thought, its the Hudson River, the Statue of Liberty in the background ... but all I saw was rocks and heavy water."

The worst are the big waves when you are not used to swimming in such conditions with salt water. Its so hard. The best is to swim in nice places of the world where the people make holidays. These are the best places on the Earth.



19. If you could have five people round for dinner (anyone who ever lived), who would they be; why; and what would you serve them?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

"I need a couple of comedians, so I'll have Michael McIntyre (stand-up comedian) and James Corden, author of ""Gavin and Stacey - From Barry [where Davies was born] to Billericay""; I'll need a couple of good looking girls ... Maria Sharapova and Cari [Davies, not married just happen to share the same name] my girlfriend; and Nelson Mandela for the stories and the inspiration. I'd have some Nando's [chicken restaurant chain] sent in and we and we could serve that!"

"Michael Schumacher: because he's the best driver in the world.
Eric Koston: one of the best skateboarders.
Joey Ramone: leader of The Ramones.
Elvis Presley
Mohammed Ali
I would serve them McDonalds because i like it very much [smiley]"



20. You're banished to a desert island but you are allowed to take three things (and those cannot be another person) - what would you take and why - and dod you think you'd be tempted to swim for it without knowing how far to the the next island?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

I would definitely be tempted to swim for it because I'd get so bored. I'd want my iPod ... you know what, I'd swim for it straight away, and I'd want a shiny suit so I could swim for it a bit quicker! I'd want my car [Audi A3] and a bottomless flask of pure, fresh Welsh water.

I would take a fishing rod, knife and a skateboard. I would not swim because I know how big the ocean is and how strong it can be and the human power is nothing against this.



21. What are your aspirations for 2010 and beyond to 2012?

David Davies (GBR)    Thomas Lurz (GER)

2010 is about performing over 1,500m in October. Open water is not a focal point this year but I do want to get back up to the fitness level I had in 2008 by world championships [marathon] in July in Canada. In 2012 it will be all about achieving the ultimate: bronze [2004], silver [2008] and gold ... I don't think anyone's done that before. I'd love to be a pub quizz for a couple of years.

In 2010, the European Championships in Budapest, the Games in London and then beyond 2012 to get a good job where I can be sucessful.



Interviews conducted by Craig Lord, published in January 2010